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Time for Dan to go?

The place to talk Redbird Men's Basketball
Humdinger
Senior
Posts: 1702
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 3:04 pm

Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:49 pm

ricohill wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:45 pm
I disagree with most of what you say as well. Considering you posted that I was a tool 15 minutes ago makes me laugh about naming calling.

Name calling and accusations are known as logic and facts by others.
Hence why i called you a tool. Logic and fact of reading your posts has led me to this personal conclusion. My opinion only! I expect to receive a temporary to permanent ban for this comment, and I would deserve it. But I stand by it. Have a nice day.
ricohill
Senior
Posts: 1886
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2017 11:00 pm

Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:57 pm

Humdinger wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:45 pm
ricohill wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:24 pm

What proof do you have that Dayton reaches out to Muller? Are you Muller?
25 plus years of professional and personal friendships in the D1 admin and coaching world. Dayton was negotiating with Grant, it hit a snag, UofD reached out to Muller. He was not their primary candidate, though. Had Grant not signed Dan would have been a prime candidate and that was point of the reachout, essentially.
Seems like a long stretch to go from Grant to Muller. One went to multiple NCAA tournaments and coached a power 5 program to a guy that went to 2 NIT's. The version I was told was Muller was reaching out to multiple jobs looking to get out, but wasn't any serious interest. Schools reach out to a ton of candidates and most are just a courtesy. See the documentary on Kansas hiring Les Miles.

Also, I just assume you either work in the athletic department, friend, or relative of someone. I can't imagine someone blindly supporting the athletic department or basketball program with how things have gone.

Also, I hope you don't get a ban. I think bans, locking down threads, and the non-sense that the whiny babies on here complain about is dumb. You want to call me a tool, I'm not soft enough to worry.
Impeach Dietz, Lyons, and Muller
CaliRdBrd
Senior
Posts: 1381
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 12:24 pm

Sun Jan 12, 2020 4:13 pm

Wow!
Shining a spotlight of reality on this hot mess of a program sure gets some panties in a bunch.
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jamminjamarsmiley
Sophomore
Posts: 468
Joined: Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:20 pm

Sun Jan 12, 2020 4:52 pm

Humdinger wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:45 pm
ricohill wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:24 pm

What proof do you have that Dayton reaches out to Muller? Are you Muller?
25 plus years of professional and personal friendships in the D1 admin and coaching world. Dayton was negotiating with Grant, it hit a snag, UofD reached out to Muller. He was not their primary candidate, though. Had Grant not signed Dan would have been a prime candidate and that was point of the reachout, essentially.
For someone so well connected with so many friends in the business, I find it odd you spend your time posting on a fan forum with the bottom feeders that live in these things.

Also, from this story you tell (which I am not sure I buy, but I cannot refute), it appears Dayton reached out to Dan, simply as a bluff to Grant that they might go another direction. I find it hard to believe a school like Dayton would look to Dan to lead their storied program. If they did their due diligence, they would have found a program riddled with off the court arrests, and a coach who simply couldn't ever win the big game. Those are facts.
Birdswin
Junior
Posts: 565
Joined: Thu Jul 20, 2017 7:58 pm

Tue Jan 14, 2020 6:39 pm

I find what rico has to say is RIGHT ON TARGET and a view shared by many of my former roommates and teammates.
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Bird Friend
Senior
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Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 5:29 pm

Tue Jan 14, 2020 10:22 pm

I find that Rico's "facts" are really just his opinions. And it seems he thinks that if he says them often enough and loud enough, they become facts.

He musta been a marketing major.
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ricohill
Senior
Posts: 1886
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2017 11:00 pm

Wed Jan 15, 2020 8:26 am

Bird Friend wrote:
Tue Jan 14, 2020 10:22 pm
I find that Rico's "facts" are really just his opinions. And it seems he thinks that if he says them often enough and loud enough, they become facts.

He musta been a marketing major.
Yes, because stats, analytics, numbers, and comparisons are usually not facts. You got me.
Impeach Dietz, Lyons, and Muller
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Bird Friend
Senior
Posts: 2840
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 5:29 pm

Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:04 pm

ricohill wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 8:26 am
Bird Friend wrote:
Tue Jan 14, 2020 10:22 pm
I find that Rico's "facts" are really just his opinions. And it seems he thinks that if he says them often enough and loud enough, they become facts.

He musta been a marketing major.
Yes, because stats, analytics, numbers, and comparisons are usually not facts. You got me.
Because histrionics attached to any 'evidence' is marketing . . . Because presenting stats, numbers, and analytics without context or in leading ways is marketing . . . Because using only the stats, numbers, etc. that support your view is marketing . . . Because using a screen name that is the same as a former Redbird great in order to gain credibility is marketing.

Because refusing to acknowledge that others' views of the same data may have any merit is bullheaded arrogance. Because it's bullheaded arrogance to assume anyone who disagrees with you is ignorant, blind, or a kool-aid guzzler.

Because your ad hominem attacks say more about your position than any "facts" you may present. Because it seems to me that your response to any pushback is:

Image
Image
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Bird Friend
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Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 5:29 pm

Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:20 pm

cubird wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:14 pm
Wondering if Lyons increased the assistant coaching budget to get Dan more experienced coaches rather than hiring 2 young assistants?
Don't know the facts, but my opinion is that you're right. That also makes me think this means Lyons will give Dan another year to get the program moving back in the right direction.
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gored birds
Freshman
Posts: 10
Joined: Wed May 15, 2019 8:57 am

Wed Jan 15, 2020 2:16 pm

Bird Friend wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:04 pm
ricohill wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 8:26 am
Bird Friend wrote:
Tue Jan 14, 2020 10:22 pm
I find that Rico's "facts" are really just his opinions. And it seems he thinks that if he says them often enough and loud enough, they become facts.

He musta been a marketing major.
Yes, because stats, analytics, numbers, and comparisons are usually not facts. You got me.
Because histrionics attached to any 'evidence' is marketing . . . Because presenting stats, numbers, and analytics without context or in leading ways is marketing . . . Because using only the stats, numbers, etc. that support your view is marketing . . . Because using a screen name that is the same as a former Redbird great in order to gain credibility is marketing.

Because refusing to acknowledge that others' views of the same data may have any merit is bullheaded arrogance. Because it's bullheaded arrogance to assume anyone who disagrees with you is ignorant, blind, or a kool-aid guzzler.

Because your ad hominem attacks say more about your position than any "facts" you may present. Because it seems to me that your response to any pushback is:

Image
everything is marketing. this board is just people marketing their opinions about isu bb. that's why we read.

rico markets his opinions w/ stats. selective stats, yes, but it's still real data. seems the best way to shut him up would be stats to refute his arguments. he's clearly not bothered by other methods & attacks.
Reggie Redbird
Sophomore
Posts: 468
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 1:02 pm

Thu Jan 16, 2020 12:06 am

Bird Friend wrote:
Sat Jan 11, 2020 4:10 pm

The crash was a seminal moment for the entire department, in the wrong way. Lost the top assistant coach, who was prolly their top recruiter. Also lost the top asst AD, who was also the AD of the future (would already have replaced Lyons), and would have been much more active than Lyons. The ripples from the crash are really still pretty strong.
The crash was a horrible moment. We lost some amazing people beyond the amazing guys Torrey and Aaron were. However, there is no reason it should be negatively impacting operations in a materially negative way.

At this point, if we’re saying we couldn’t identify another future AD beyond Aaron, then that reflects badly on us. There are ADs at smaller schools and top deputies at other schools who are succeeding. There are many we could hire to try and push us to new heights. Heck, we could have hired Sheahon again and brought back most of his staff if we wanted. There are also many former assets/assocs, etc who could be brought back in if we want someone with a past here.

I could see Torrey getting a head job and venturing out that way. Like Yak, I viewed him as someone who could come back someday as a head coach. Again, if we’re saying we can’t succeed years down the road from this tragedy, we need to bring in a new coach and AD because then they will never succeed. Just like Yak and Oliver, Torrey was on the path to move up, deservedly so.
ricohill
Senior
Posts: 1886
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2017 11:00 pm

Thu Jan 16, 2020 8:30 am

Reggie Redbird wrote:
Thu Jan 16, 2020 12:06 am
Bird Friend wrote:
Sat Jan 11, 2020 4:10 pm

The crash was a seminal moment for the entire department, in the wrong way. Lost the top assistant coach, who was prolly their top recruiter. Also lost the top asst AD, who was also the AD of the future (would already have replaced Lyons), and would have been much more active than Lyons. The ripples from the crash are really still pretty strong.
The crash was a horrible moment. We lost some amazing people beyond the amazing guys Torrey and Aaron were. However, there is no reason it should be negatively impacting operations in a materially negative way.

At this point, if we’re saying we couldn’t identify another future AD beyond Aaron, then that reflects badly on us. There are ADs at smaller schools and top deputies at other schools who are succeeding. There are many we could hire to try and push us to new heights. Heck, we could have hired Sheahon again and brought back most of his staff if we wanted. There are also many former assets/assocs, etc who could be brought back in if we want someone with a past here.

I could see Torrey getting a head job and venturing out that way. Like Yak, I viewed him as someone who could come back someday as a head coach. Again, if we’re saying we can’t succeed years down the road from this tragedy, we need to bring in a new coach and AD because then they will never succeed. Just like Yak and Oliver, Torrey was on the path to move up, deservedly so.
:text-+1: :text-+1: :text-+1: :text-+1: :text-+1:
Impeach Dietz, Lyons, and Muller
FriscoBird90
Freshman
Posts: 50
Joined: Tue Jul 25, 2017 2:53 pm

Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:14 pm

If this team fails to show significant progress between now and the end of the season, it will certainly be time for Dan to go. At this point, the trend line over the past 2+ years is not looking good and does not offer much hope for such needed improvement over the next 2 months.

If/when Dan is gone, ISU should look at its history of hires for guidance as to the approach to take for its next head coach. While acknowledging each hire is a bit of a craps shoot as to how it will eventually work out, there seems to be a pattern in terms of what has, and has not, worked out so well. The more successful hires of the last 40+ years in terms of post-season play and number of quality seasons in conference play have been assistant coaches from top notch programs (Donewald and Stallings for certain, Bender and Jankovich to a lesser degree). The least successful hires have been an internal hire/former Stallings assistant (Richardson) and a head coach who was stepping up from what was then considered a "lesser" program (Moser). My opinion only, but while I place Muller, another former Stallings assistant, above Moser and Richardson, his trend line is pointing downward, perhaps as much or even more so than Donewald's at the time he was terminated back in 1989.
TBS_20
Freshman
Posts: 16
Joined: Sun Dec 22, 2019 3:54 pm

Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:30 pm

Some on the Missouri State 247 board are already asking for Dana Ford to be fired after 1.5 years and a 24-26 record. They say the team has no identity or culture.
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isuquinndog
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Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:34 pm

TBS_20 wrote:
Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:30 pm
Some on the Missouri State 247 board are already asking for Dana Ford to be fired after 1.5 years and a 24-26 record. They say the team has no identity or culture.
I mean, they lost UGLY last night at home to BU
LET'S WIN THIS GAME!
Buffett
Sophomore
Posts: 282
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:34 am

Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:54 pm

isuquinndog wrote:
Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:34 pm
TBS_20 wrote:
Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:30 pm
Some on the Missouri State 247 board are already asking for Dana Ford to be fired after 1.5 years and a 24-26 record. They say the team has no identity or culture.
I mean, they lost UGLY last night at home to BU
With out BU's best player...
SgtHulka
Senior
Posts: 1712
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 12:41 pm

Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:56 pm

FriscoBird90 wrote:
Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:14 pm
If this team fails to show significant progress between now and the end of the season, it will certainly be time for Dan to go. At this point, the trend line over the past 2+ years is not looking good and does not offer much hope for such needed improvement over the next 2 months.

If/when Dan is gone, ISU should look at its history of hires for guidance as to the approach to take for its next head coach. While acknowledging each hire is a bit of a craps shoot as to how it will eventually work out, there seems to be a pattern in terms of what has, and has not, worked out so well. The more successful hires of the last 40+ years in terms of post-season play and number of quality seasons in conference play have been assistant coaches from top notch programs (Donewald and Stallings for certain, Bender and Jankovich to a lesser degree). The least successful hires have been an internal hire/former Stallings assistant (Richardson) and a head coach who was stepping up from what was then considered a "lesser" program (Moser). My opinion only, but while I place Muller, another former Stallings assistant, above Moser and Richardson, his trend line is pointing downward, perhaps as much or even more so than Donewald's at the time he was terminated back in 1989.
Have faith. 90% of the suggested replacements on here when the time comes will be former Redbirds
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gobirds85
Junior
Posts: 676
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 3:45 pm

Thu Jan 16, 2020 2:05 pm

Gimme Jimmy!!! The UCD coach might be looking for a new gig shortly as that teams sucks YUGLY! We can get him cheap...probably a few gondolas, weekday movie passes and an old Buick that was only driven to church by a local elderly women.

He knows the Valley and Chicago, and would love to stick it to bu. Just a thought.

ADunk could be the president of his local fan club and Jimmy can wear a "Sucks to bu" tee every time we play them. Karma.
Buffett
Sophomore
Posts: 282
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:34 am

Thu Jan 16, 2020 2:22 pm

gobirds85 wrote:
Thu Jan 16, 2020 2:05 pm
Gimme Jimmy!!! The UCD coach might be looking for a new gig shortly as that teams sucks YUGLY! We can get him cheap...probably a few gondolas, weekday movie passes and an old Buick that was only driven to church by a local elderly women.

He knows the Valley and Chicago, and would love to stick it to bu. Just a thought.

ADunk could be the president of his local fan club and Jimmy can wear a "Sucks to bu" tee every time we play them. Karma.
ISU will have the same record as UCD by 10 pm tonight
IHateWSU
Freshman
Posts: 125
Joined: Tue Jul 25, 2017 4:23 pm

Thu Jan 16, 2020 2:31 pm

Give me Scott Nagy. I was told he applied when we hired Dan, but we did not give him the time of day. He went on to lead SD St to an NCAA, and now at Wright St.
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