If you are having problems getting into your account, email me (isuquinndog@redbirdfan.net) from the email you signed up with and your username.

Two Deep Offense

The place to talk Redbird Football

Moderator: Football Moderators

User avatar
Total Red
Sophomore
Posts: 399
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 12:42 pm

Sun Feb 10, 2019 12:44 pm

1st Team Offense

T Himmelman
G Megginson
C Bones
G Rients
T Solomon
TE Gillum
WR Edgar
WR Haley
Slot Grimes
QB Davis
RB Robinson
FB McCloyn

2nd Team Offense

T Asche
G Anderson
C Hirsch
G Mueller
T Day
TE Taula
WR Blackman
WR Nagel
Slot Rutkiewicz
QB Jefferson
RB Proctor
FB Kelly


No disclaimer or caveat. Unlike the List so Far this is written in stone. If there's one thing we've learned in our years of observing Redbird Football and Basketball is that there is absolutely no fluidity to the situation. The fortunes of youthful student-athletes are completely foreseeable and immutable. As it is written so shall it be.
fourthandshort
Senior
Posts: 1823
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:06 pm

Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:30 pm

Only real questions are at Center and WR, then backup QB and RB. You got Bones in there over Hirsch ... Bones is up from 305 to 335 in 2 years. Very interest to see if WR Blackman in play maker at this level, and if WR Haley becomes a more consistent factor. Got to believe our OL will be more consistent this year .. they kind of faded late season against top defenses. Then of course, we need a much better short-inetrmediate pass game from our QB .... got to take some pressure of Robinson .. and we're probably going to miss Smith at times.
Redbird Nation Rising ... Fans and donors need to get on board !!
ISUBU
Freshman
Posts: 187
Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2017 9:33 pm

Sun Feb 10, 2019 9:46 pm

Pretty sure Bones replaced Hirsch for the last few games last year. Will be interesting to see how that plays out. Solomon simply has more experience, so I think you're right there.

This does look really solid. We'll use multiple receivers at times, as well as two tight ends. Those guys can all expect to play.

QB depth is less experienced than it has been for a couple seasons. Spring will be important for Davis to make the improvements we'd like to see, but they need to give some time to the young QBs to bring them along. Have we heard anything confirmed about Davis's eligibility? 2019 and/or 2020? I'm guessing this season is it for him.
User avatar
StLRedbird
Sophomore
Posts: 304
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:09 pm

Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:00 am

My recollection is Spack said Davis 2020 was a lead pipe cinch. I haven't seen a confirmation that the NCAA views it that way.

Agreed there aren't many obvious issues on the two deep beside WR and RB depth. Hopefully this group puts it together.
User avatar
Redbirdwarrior
Junior
Posts: 595
Joined: Tue Jul 18, 2017 4:46 pm

Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:18 am

Davis is 100% your QB for the next 2 years. The guy is incredibly talented. That said, I STILL wish we were more read option like we were back in 2012-2014. That style just flat out works better at this level than pro-style offense. But, the rosters you have here are STRONG. Robinson is just a monster and I expect that this will indeed be "Running back U FCS" for the next 4 years or so, given the 3 star recruits that have come in.
MadBird
Junior
Posts: 565
Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2017 10:50 pm
Location: Madison, Wisconsin

Mon Feb 11, 2019 1:27 pm

Well, I'm totally refreshed from the RB U. kool aid, no argument from me there, altho for the most part (except for J Rob) we haven't seen any on field performance, BUT . . .

there ain't gonna be no RB U. w/o some OL U., so we better get that straightened out ASAP. The transfer from UIUC didn't really make his mark there, so we'll have to hope he develops later rather than sooner (like Bello did, for example). Time for last year's guys to bust out, overcome injuries, whatever happened to them.
fourthandshort
Senior
Posts: 1823
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:06 pm

Mon Feb 11, 2019 2:33 pm

Redbirdwarrior wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:18 am
Davis is 100% your QB for the next 2 years. The guy is incredibly talented. That said, I STILL wish we were more read option like we were back in 2012-2014. That style just flat out works better at this level than pro-style offense. But, the rosters you have here are STRONG. Robinson is just a monster and I expect that this will indeed be "Running back U FCS" for the next 4 years or so, given the 3 star recruits that have come in.
think the question is will NCAA approve his 6th year for medical redshirt ??

I'm more optimistic about Davis in 2019 than I was after August 2018 camp ... getting in a full offseason with WRs and OC Beathard should make a big difference. If nothing else, Beathard will have firmer grasp on where Davis is most comfortable. It took til better part of 2014 season for Beathard to figure out Roberson, but Robersons read-option and deep ball really kept every defense honest, along with Coprich, while Roberson figured out our pass attack ... then he just lit up FCS after week 8.

Our 2018 schedule was very tough on latter half, and our offense went into decline ... combination of issues, but I feel better about Beathard and Davis figuring it all out in 2019. My issue was accuracy and familiarity ... You just can't move chains completing 50% of passes. I was very skeptical .. turned out for good reason. Davis was so worried about not throwing picks, i think it affected his completion rate without doubt .... familiarity that comes from full offseason can only help. Davis clearly has talent .. just needs to get more comfortable and familiar.
Redbird Nation Rising ... Fans and donors need to get on board !!
User avatar
Redbirdwarrior
Junior
Posts: 595
Joined: Tue Jul 18, 2017 4:46 pm

Mon Feb 11, 2019 3:06 pm

fourthandshort wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 2:33 pm
Redbirdwarrior wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:18 am
Davis is 100% your QB for the next 2 years. The guy is incredibly talented. That said, I STILL wish we were more read option like we were back in 2012-2014. That style just flat out works better at this level than pro-style offense. But, the rosters you have here are STRONG. Robinson is just a monster and I expect that this will indeed be "Running back U FCS" for the next 4 years or so, given the 3 star recruits that have come in.
think the question is will NCAA approve his 6th year for medical redshirt ??

I'm more optimistic about Davis in 2019 than I was after August 2018 camp ... getting in a full offseason with WRs and OC Beathard should make a big difference. If nothing else, Beathard will have firmer grasp on where Davis is most comfortable. It took til better part of 2014 season for Beathard to figure out Roberson, but Robersons read-option and deep ball really kept every defense honest, along with Coprich, while Roberson figured out our pass attack ... then he just lit up FCS after week 8.

Our 2018 schedule was very tough on latter half, and our offense went into decline ... combination of issues, but I feel better about Beathard and Davis figuring it all out in 2019. My issue was accuracy and familiarity ... You just can't move chains completing 50% of passes. I was very skeptical .. turned out for good reason. Davis was so worried about not throwing picks, i think it affected his completion rate without doubt .... familiarity that comes from full offseason can only help. Davis clearly has talent .. just needs to get more comfortable and familiar.
I thought that it was approved at some point during our season and technically he qualified as a sophomore. Sorry if I am mistaken on that.
fourthandshort
Senior
Posts: 1823
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:06 pm

Mon Feb 11, 2019 4:05 pm

Redbirdwarrior wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 3:06 pm
fourthandshort wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 2:33 pm
Redbirdwarrior wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:18 am
Davis is 100% your QB for the next 2 years. The guy is incredibly talented. That said, I STILL wish we were more read option like we were back in 2012-2014. That style just flat out works better at this level than pro-style offense. But, the rosters you have here are STRONG. Robinson is just a monster and I expect that this will indeed be "Running back U FCS" for the next 4 years or so, given the 3 star recruits that have come in.
think the question is will NCAA approve his 6th year for medical redshirt ??

I'm more optimistic about Davis in 2019 than I was after August 2018 camp ... getting in a full offseason with WRs and OC Beathard should make a big difference. If nothing else, Beathard will have firmer grasp on where Davis is most comfortable. It took til better part of 2014 season for Beathard to figure out Roberson, but Robersons read-option and deep ball really kept every defense honest, along with Coprich, while Roberson figured out our pass attack ... then he just lit up FCS after week 8.

Our 2018 schedule was very tough on latter half, and our offense went into decline ... combination of issues, but I feel better about Beathard and Davis figuring it all out in 2019. My issue was accuracy and familiarity ... You just can't move chains completing 50% of passes. I was very skeptical .. turned out for good reason. Davis was so worried about not throwing picks, i think it affected his completion rate without doubt .... familiarity that comes from full offseason can only help. Davis clearly has talent .. just needs to get more comfortable and familiar.
I thought that it was approved at some point during our season and technically he qualified as a sophomore. Sorry if I am mistaken on that.
agree with stlrb ... Spack sounds confident, but nothing official from NCAA yet. The Goredbirds Roster still lists Davis as SR for next fall.

Side note, Gage Gabrud of EWU just got approved and he played like 4 games this past year .. still got a 6th year for despite playing 4 games. They damn well better approve Davis.

http://www.anygivensaturday.com/showthr ... llege-ball
Redbird Nation Rising ... Fans and donors need to get on board !!
User avatar
TIMMY
Senior
Posts: 985
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:28 pm
Location: 1050 W Addison

Wed Feb 13, 2019 9:26 am

I can see why TR has Proctor running with the 2's. He can run it, catch it and even block a little. You can see what Iowa St. saw in him. Some real pretty KO Ret's. on tape. No dancing. He just hits it. Should be a great compliment to Robinson.
http://www.hudl.com/athlete/1441121/jeff-proctor

I saw a friend who's at L-W East at the Glazier Clinic this past weekend and he thinks Baltz will play for ISU. Kids a stick right now but he's a hard worker who should fill out in time.
fourthandshort
Senior
Posts: 1823
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:06 pm

Wed Feb 13, 2019 10:00 am

TIMMY wrote:
Wed Feb 13, 2019 9:26 am
I can see why TR has Proctor running with the 2's. He can run it, catch it and even block a little. You can see what Iowa St. saw in him. Some real pretty KO Ret's. on tape. No dancing. He just hits it. Should be a great compliment to Robinson.
http://www.hudl.com/athlete/1441121/jeff-proctor

I saw a friend who's at L-W East at the Glazier Clinic this past weekend and he thinks Baltz will play for ISU. Kids a stick right now but he's a hard worker who should fill out in time.
Impressive get with 3 years experience, including his true FR year at Iowa St .. not yet sure why he dropped down to Juco. His highlight reel is impressive, but have to temper it with knowledge, he has an FBS year under his belt and was playing against all FR and SO. That said, he is quick, fast, and very powerful for his size .. he will be ready for MVFC and FCS defenses. He can make people miss all 3 ways ... spedd (run by you), quicks (run around you), and break tackles (run thru you) .. he is very tough. Just to contrast him to Nigel White (3 years younger), White goes down pretty easy at this point ... Proctor does not.

One observation of concern ... of his 7 kick returns, he muffed the catch on 3 of them ... might be nothing, but Coprich struggled at KR his true FR season as well and still found a "role" for himself at ISU.

But I will be surprised if Proctor isn't Robinson's primary back up. I like the same ratio as Robinson/Smith last season ... 65/35 split of carries. Except difference is Proctor is change of pace guy who can take a hit and get more yards. Smith was all power at 230 lbs .. effectively fast & quick enough for 230 lbs at FCS level, but Proctor will give us a new dimension that teams will have to game plan for.
Redbird Nation Rising ... Fans and donors need to get on board !!
User avatar
TIMMY
Senior
Posts: 985
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:28 pm
Location: 1050 W Addison

Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:16 pm

fourthandshort wrote:
Wed Feb 13, 2019 10:00 am
TIMMY wrote:
Wed Feb 13, 2019 9:26 am
I can see why TR has Proctor running with the 2's. He can run it, catch it and even block a little. You can see what Iowa St. saw in him. Some real pretty KO Ret's. on tape. No dancing. He just hits it. Should be a great compliment to Robinson.
http://www.hudl.com/athlete/1441121/jeff-proctor

I saw a friend who's at L-W East at the Glazier Clinic this past weekend and he thinks Baltz will play for ISU. Kids a stick right now but he's a hard worker who should fill out in time.
Impressive get with 3 years experience, including his true FR year at Iowa St .. not yet sure why he dropped down to Juco. His highlight reel is impressive, but have to temper it with knowledge, he has an FBS year under his belt and was playing against all FR and SO. That said, he is quick, fast, and very powerful for his size .. he will be ready for MVFC and FCS defenses. He can make people miss all 3 ways ... spedd (run by you), quicks (run around you), and break tackles (run thru you) .. he is very tough. Just to contrast him to Nigel White (3 years younger), White goes down pretty easy at this point ... Proctor does not.

One observation of concern ... of his 7 kick returns, he muffed the catch on 3 of them ... might be nothing, but Coprich struggled at KR his true FR season as well and still found a "role" for himself at ISU.

But I will be surprised if Proctor isn't Robinson's primary back up. I like the same ratio as Robinson/Smith last season ... 65/35 split of carries. Except difference is Proctor is change of pace guy who can take a hit and get more yards. Smith was all power at 230 lbs .. effectively fast & quick enough for 230 lbs at FCS level, but Proctor will give us a new dimension that teams will have to game plan for.
It will be interesting to see if they get on the field much together. Proctor in the slot. Fast motion, jet sweeps, RPO's, screens. And of course the occasional JUMP pass. :o
User avatar
Virginia Redbird
Sophomore
Posts: 312
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:51 pm
Location: Chesapeake, Virginia

Wed Feb 13, 2019 8:29 pm

Redbirdwarrior wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:18 am
Davis is 100% your QB for the next 2 years. The guy is incredibly talented. That said, I STILL wish we were more read option like we were back in 2012-2014. That style just flat out works better at this level than pro-style offense. But, the rosters you have here are STRONG. Robinson is just a monster and I expect that this will indeed be "Running back U FCS" for the next 4 years or so, given the 3 star recruits that have come in.
"incredibly talented"? Sorry, but I did not see that with Davis last season. Potential? Absolutely. He was new to the system and had not played in a few years so probably rusty...yes. I am not down on Davis but I did not see this incredible talent either. Being a Redbird fan I sincerely hope he has a great season next year but if it is more of the same as 2018 then I hope one of the new QBs replaces him in 2020 like Davis replaced Kolbe last season. I am hoping for a solid 2019 season from Davis but that is with concern that we have already seen his best, which is not good enough.
The running back stable should be impressive but I honestly am beginning to have some concerns as it seems the team is bleeding players that leave the program. Players are going to leave I know. That, especially today, is the nature of college football. There seem to be quite a few discipline problems and that makes me wonder about the criteria for recruitment. It seems the Birds are still getting a decent amount of transfers from FBS programs and recruiting seems to be getting in some talented players but it just seems to me the Birds have had to very mediocre seasons and quite a few players leaving the program. That does not sound like a good news story.
“When you have great players, playing great, well that’s great football!”
John Madden
JHBird
Senior
Posts: 774
Joined: Thu Jul 20, 2017 4:40 pm

Thu Feb 14, 2019 7:32 am

Early last year I was pretty high on Davis, but he had some really awful throws. At first I thought it was caused by not knowing the offense, but he didn't approve his accuracy much. He needs to get his completion pct above 60 and use his running ability more. What I did like about him was his moxy, and how he didn't turn the ball over too much. Being here for spring ball will help him I think.
User avatar
Total Red
Sophomore
Posts: 399
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 12:42 pm

Thu Feb 14, 2019 7:50 am

JHBird wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 7:32 am
He needs to get his completion pct above 60 and use his running ability more. What I did like about him was his moxy, and how he didn't turn the ball over too much. Being here for spring ball will help him I think.
:text-+1: I would use Clemson's Trevor Lawrence and his performance against 'Bama as a template for what we need from Brady Davis this year. Higher passing % while keeping Int's low and running just enough to make the defense account for him so it's 11 on 11. He knows the offense now and Beathard knows him. They'll have a full spring and summer to prepare. Can he raise his game to the Championship level? I don't know but I just renewed my season tickets. :D
fourthandshort
Senior
Posts: 1823
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:06 pm

Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:02 am

combining and restating TR, VirginiaRB and JHbird thoughts ... Davis was most certainly walking into a situation having not playe meaningfull game reps since his senior year in HS. He had a RS season, and injury season, then another season where he was 3rd string. Then he transfers during summer with no benefit of spring or winter ball .. splits the reps 50/50 with Kolbe in a brand new system. My concern all along was his accuracy ... clearly he has talent, strong arm, very good pocket sense, and knew the importance of limiting turnovers. But no meaningful game reps in over 3 years, combined with getting thrust into new system and teammates ... his issue with accuracy was bound to become mroe obvious. Not to mention, the flip side ... OC Beathard having to split reps all of August to figure out his starter .. then how to prepare game plans for a QB he didn't know well at all.

They've got a full offseason to work out the kinks, for everyone to figure each other out, get more practice reps together and simply get much more familiar. I could be wrong, but given Davis's strenghths, i think he will be improved this year ... guessing he will never be a high % guy, but if he gets closer to 60%, that will do. Then this opens up playbook for OC Beathard and running game for Robinson ... then watch the chains move much more consistently this year.
Redbird Nation Rising ... Fans and donors need to get on board !!
JHBird
Senior
Posts: 774
Joined: Thu Jul 20, 2017 4:40 pm

Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:58 am

One thing I would add, maybe you guys feel the same way. It just seemed to me that the rest of our offensive players have confidence in Davis, and yeah, I forgot how little football he had played before starting here, and how he really needed that spring session. But it is what it was. I think it helps his confidence knowing we don't really have a threat on the roster to take his job, at least I don't see one. So he's definitely the man, and will get most of the reps. He should improve dramatically, and let's hope he has two more years left. With the basketball team sucking I'm really fired up for some spring ball! The red and white game should be more exciting than some of the basketball I've been watching...
User avatar
Redbirdwarrior
Junior
Posts: 595
Joined: Tue Jul 18, 2017 4:46 pm

Thu Feb 14, 2019 2:52 pm

The key for next year is to get the ball to James Robinson 25+ times a game every single game. That guy is your playmaker and a potential NFL starter. Davis spent a ton of time throwing 18 yard out routs and having safeties jump those toward the end of the season. You gotta pull those safeties down by getting the ball to Robinson between the tackles, around the end and in the short passing game. You then have like 3 guys that are behind him that, on paper, should be able to absolutely shred defenses as spells.

Get the O to play through the HB and STICK TO THAT. Even if they put 7,8 in the box.
fourthandshort
Senior
Posts: 1823
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:06 pm

Thu Feb 14, 2019 5:14 pm

Redbirdwarrior wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 2:52 pm
The key for next year is to get the ball to James Robinson 25+ times a game every single game. That guy is your playmaker and a potential NFL starter. Davis spent a ton of time throwing 18 yard out routs and having safeties jump those toward the end of the season. You gotta pull those safeties down by getting the ball to Robinson between the tackles, around the end and in the short passing game. You then have like 3 guys that are behind him that, on paper, should be able to absolutely shred defenses as spells.

Get the O to play through the HB and STICK TO THAT. Even if they put 7,8 in the box.
we struggled to do that as season progressed .. particularly in that our schedule got tougher and the better defensive teams figured us out ... largely because pass game deteriorated. I agree we need to lead with run game, but need our pass game to keep the good defenses honest.

Remember the 1st half against MoST (game 4) and 2nd half against WIU (game 5) ... this revealed our weakness. Then when it came time to play against the big 3 in weeks 7, 8, & 9 ... NDSU, UNI, and SDSU ... our offense couldn't handle it. They saw our weakness on offense and they we're able to contain us. We handled ISUb pretty well in game 10 .. but imploded in Q2 and had play from behind .. we probably make playoffs if we beat ISUb .. we outgained them 488 to 283 and lost by 5. Many thought ISUb was the most screwed team to not make playoff.

If we figure out the pass game, we're going to be very good.
Redbird Nation Rising ... Fans and donors need to get on board !!
User avatar
Virginia Redbird
Sophomore
Posts: 312
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:51 pm
Location: Chesapeake, Virginia

Sun Feb 17, 2019 7:57 am

fourthandshort wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 5:14 pm
Redbirdwarrior wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 2:52 pm
The key for next year is to get the ball to James Robinson 25+ times a game every single game. That guy is your playmaker and a potential NFL starter. Davis spent a ton of time throwing 18 yard out routs and having safeties jump those toward the end of the season. You gotta pull those safeties down by getting the ball to Robinson between the tackles, around the end and in the short passing game. You then have like 3 guys that are behind him that, on paper, should be able to absolutely shred defenses as spells.

Get the O to play through the HB and STICK TO THAT. Even if they put 7,8 in the box.
we struggled to do that as season progressed .. particularly in that our schedule got tougher and the better defensive teams figured us out ... largely because pass game deteriorated. I agree we need to lead with run game, but need our pass game to keep the good defenses honest.

Remember the 1st half against MoST (game 4) and 2nd half against WIU (game 5) ... this revealed our weakness. Then when it came time to play against the big 3 in weeks 7, 8, & 9 ... NDSU, UNI, and SDSU ... our offense couldn't handle it. They saw our weakness on offense and they we're able to contain us. We handled ISUb pretty well in game 10 .. but imploded in Q2 and had play from behind .. we probably make playoffs if we beat ISUb .. we outgained them 488 to 283 and lost by 5. Many thought ISUb was the most screwed team to not make playoff.

If we figure out the pass game, we're going to be very good.
No doubt if the Birds come out and just run the ball it will not go well. Last year the passing game was not very consistent. Brady was very inaccurate at times and as the season wore on and the defenses they faced got better it became very apparent they were fairly one dimensional. There were some flashes of Brady's talents last season but not anywhere near consistent. Some young receivers showed some good things last season. The running backs look pretty good much like last season. The O-Line looks to be solid but the passing game has got to develop into a real threat or other teams will just stack the line and dare Brady to toss the ball. In my opinion, the biggest problem overall for Redbird football is inconsistency. One game they look great and the net they lose to a team they should beat (MoState). As Fourth pointed out they have also been inconsistent from quarter to quarter in some games. That is a coaching problem to me. I am hoping the coaching staff work out the kinks for 2019.
“When you have great players, playing great, well that’s great football!”
John Madden
Post Reply