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What are you expectations for the season now?

The place to talk Redbird Men's Basketball
ChiRedbirdfan
Senior
Posts: 1238
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 4:48 pm

Mon Nov 12, 2018 8:57 pm

Humdinger wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 8:34 pm
I do believe the expectation should be a NCAA bid each year, whether through at-large or The Tourney.

Is that realistic? It certainly could be. 20 years is shocking, really. Got to hand it to Donewald, he made us a borderline top 20 program in 83-84-85. Think about that! Then our 70's 'Birds were playing some of the top teams in the country...and beating some of them while playing an exciting brand of up-tempo ball.

Stallings '97-'98 group was ranked 16th in the country pre-season by SI. Arizona was stacked but I believe had we not been missing two starters we would have given them a game in the second half. That was a very seasoned group.

One thing we can all agree on is 20 yrs is tooooo long, and it's especially obvious this year, given the capability of this group.

Will - the - seniors - take - charge ? ? ?
“Aspire” to make the ncaa tourney every year indeed but “expect” to make it every year is too much, IMO. Once every three years or maybe twice every five years seems like it could be doable given how much ISU has danced around the big dance over the last decade...but even that may still be a lofty expectation

Jsnhbe1Birds
Senior
Posts: 1299
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Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:08 pm

ChiRedbirdfan wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 8:57 pm
Once every three years or maybe twice every five years seems like it could be doable but even that would still be a lofty expectation
That's the kind of thinking that keeps the program down. I'm not singling you out. The whole program thinks the same. Instead they need to think why not us. Lets make it happen. That needs to be the mindset.

ChiRedbirdfan
Senior
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Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:18 pm

Jsnhbe1Birds wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:08 pm
ChiRedbirdfan wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 8:57 pm
Once every three years or maybe twice every five years seems like it could be doable but even that would still be a lofty expectation
That's the kind of thinking that keeps the program down. I'm not singling you out. The whole program thinks the same. Instead they need to think why not us. Lets make it happen. That needs to be the mindset.
Those are expectations which means disappointment with anything less. Still can make it more often and should be trying to make it more often. How often do you EXPECT ISU to make the ncaa tourney. Starting this year how many times do you expect ISU to make the tourney in the next 20 years?

RedbirdSoxFan
Junior
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Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:44 pm

So , Southern Illinois gets beat at home against a good Buffalo team;
Loyola gets beat at home against Furman;
And Illinois State gets beat on the road against a good Belmont team, and our season is over? And, we need to look for a new coach?

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chuckie1980
Sophomore
Posts: 388
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:02 pm

Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:04 pm

I expect a MoValley championship regular season....a Arch Madness championship....and Sweet 16.

gobirds72
Freshman
Posts: 133
Joined: Sat Nov 10, 2018 8:56 pm

Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:00 am

RedbirdSoxFan wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:44 pm
So , Southern Illinois gets beat at home against a good Buffalo team;
Loyola gets beat at home against Furman;
And Illinois State gets beat on the road against a good Belmont team, and our season is over? And, we need to look for a new coach?

None of the teams you mentioned are going to the Big Dance unless they win their conference Tournament. We will need a top 25 win to overcome this loss. We lost by a lot to a team that starts 3 freshman. I don’t believe any of the freshman are McDonalds All Americans. The difference between the 3 freshman is coaching.

Humdinger
Senior
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Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:05 am

gobirds72 wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:00 am
RedbirdSoxFan wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:44 pm
So , Southern Illinois gets beat at home against a good Buffalo team;
Loyola gets beat at home against Furman;
And Illinois State gets beat on the road against a good Belmont team, and our season is over? And, we need to look for a new coach?

None of the teams you mentioned are going to the Big Dance unless they win their conference Tournament. We will need a top 25 win to overcome this loss. We lost by a lot to a team that starts 3 freshman. I don’t believe any of the freshman are McDonalds All Americans. The difference between the 3 freshman is coaching.

Buffalo #25 in country.

gobirds72
Freshman
Posts: 133
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Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:06 am

Redbirdwarrior wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 5:58 pm
Do we really have to have a thread about how our expectations are fundamentally shifted after a road loss to a perennial tournament team? ISU scored, what, 89 points?

If we get to the Caymen Islands and drop the final, is everyone going to be running around yelling NIT BUBBLE? Get real, you hyperbolic nerds.
A “perennial tournament team” out of the Ohio Valley conference starting 3 freshman. I could already hear the excuses from Coach Muller and the homers about how young we would be if we started 3 freshman.

gobirds72
Freshman
Posts: 133
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Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:07 am

Humdinger wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:05 am
gobirds72 wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:00 am
RedbirdSoxFan wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:44 pm
So , Southern Illinois gets beat at home against a good Buffalo team;
Loyola gets beat at home against Furman;
And Illinois State gets beat on the road against a good Belmont team, and our season is over? And, we need to look for a new coach?

None of the teams you mentioned are going to the Big Dance unless they win their conference Tournament. We will need a top 25 win to overcome this loss. We lost by a lot to a team that starts 3 freshman. I don’t believe any of the freshman are McDonalds All Americans. The difference between the 3 freshman is coaching.

Buffalo #25 in country.

Won’t last...lol. They had their one shining moment. :D. They will still probably win their conference tournament...but no at large.

DWRedbird
Sophomore
Posts: 330
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 12:37 pm

Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:26 am

gobirds72 wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:00 am
RedbirdSoxFan wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:44 pm
So , Southern Illinois gets beat at home against a good Buffalo team;
Loyola gets beat at home against Furman;
And Illinois State gets beat on the road against a good Belmont team, and our season is over? And, we need to look for a new coach?

None of the teams you mentioned are going to the Big Dance unless they win their conference Tournament. We will need a top 25 win to overcome this loss. We lost by a lot to a team that starts 3 freshman. I don’t believe any of the freshman are McDonalds All Americans. The difference between the 3 freshman is coaching.
Belmont plays two top 25 teams in December, they win those games and finish with 3 or less losses in conference and they could get an at large if they dont win the ovc tourney. That said I think they'll win it.

Buffalo has already beaten west Virginia and has 2 more matchups against top 25 opponents, if they remain ranked and win 1 of those 2 games, and finish top 2 in the MAC they could get an at large.

Furman is the least likely to make it without winning their conference tourney, simply because of the conference the play in, but they already have one big win on the road, and have the same opportunity for top 25 wins the other two do.

My point is, these aren't bad teams the Valley lost to. World isnt over because any of us lost to them

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SoCalRedbird
Sophomore
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Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:34 am

Lot of people on here underselling Belmont (and Buffalo)...

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ThisIsTheLineup
Sophomore
Posts: 403
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 1:04 pm

Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:54 am

gobirds72 wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:07 am
Humdinger wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:05 am
gobirds72 wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:00 am



None of the teams you mentioned are going to the Big Dance unless they win their conference Tournament. We will need a top 25 win to overcome this loss. We lost by a lot to a team that starts 3 freshman. I don’t believe any of the freshman are McDonalds All Americans. The difference between the 3 freshman is coaching.

Buffalo #25 in country.

Won’t last...lol. They had their one shining moment. :D. They will still probably win their conference tournament...but no at large.
No, they are top-25 good.

gobirds72
Freshman
Posts: 133
Joined: Sat Nov 10, 2018 8:56 pm

Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:16 am

We will see! Not impossible...but based on the selection committees track record the odds are stacked against most mid majors! They almost have to be perfect...and at times that’s not even enough!

Adunk33
Senior
Posts: 1510
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2017 9:08 am

Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:23 am

SoCalRedbird wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:34 am
Lot of people on here underselling Belmont (and Buffalo)...

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
I watched all of the Buffalo-SIU game last night... YIKES on both sides. Ugly game. Fletcher didn't play last night and SIU seemed to go with Pippen and Lloyd, who didn't have great games. The team's had over 30 TO's between the two and shot 35-40%. It didn't help that it was really poorly officiated. I would be more willing to bet on Belmont spending more time in the T25 than Buffalo after yesterday.

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isuquinndog
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Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:04 am

Redbirdwarrior wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 5:58 pm
Do we really have to have a thread about how our expectations are fundamentally shifted after a road loss to a perennial tournament team? ISU scored, what, 89 points?

If we get to the Caymen Islands and drop the final, is everyone going to be running around yelling NIT BUBBLE? Get real, you hyperbolic nerds.
Never thought I'd say it, but Redbirdwarrior with post of the year.
LET'S WIN THIS GAME!

rdt99
Freshman
Posts: 114
Joined: Tue Jul 18, 2017 8:20 am

Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:32 am

Muller once again does not have the the team ready for non conferencx games. And the Milik problem continues. Does he think the pros are not watching him not play defense? This is so disappointing so far.

RedbirdSoxFan
Junior
Posts: 509
Joined: Wed Jul 19, 2017 1:31 pm

Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:36 am

Adunk33 wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:23 am
SoCalRedbird wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:34 am
Lot of people on here underselling Belmont (and Buffalo)...

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
I watched all of the Buffalo-SIU game last night... YIKES on both sides. Ugly game. Fletcher didn't play last night and SIU seemed to go with Pippen and Lloyd, who didn't have great games. The team's had over 30 TO's between the two and shot 35-40%. It didn't help that it was really poorly officiated. I would be more willing to bet on Belmont spending more time in the T25 than Buffalo after yesterday.
Pippen 18 PTS 5 REB against Buffalo

Pippen is going to be a tough matchup for a lot of teams in Valley play. Averaged 17 PTS 6 REB against two pretty good teams (Kentucky & Buffalo)
Last edited by RedbirdSoxFan on Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

bird
Freshman
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2017 12:18 pm

Tue Nov 13, 2018 5:13 pm

SoCalRedbird wrote:
Sun Nov 11, 2018 10:32 am
I turned off the TV last night to give myself ample processing time before commenting. Lots of stuff to address--Xs and Os, Belmont's ridiculously impressive debut, our defensive woes. What a letdown! But for me, one talking point stands above the rest:

Dan Muller called Milik Yarborough 'uncoachable.' (As in, incapable of learning or making progress.)

Coach can miss me with that Mike Woodbury/Bob Knight bullshit. As a public school teacher and coach, I'm ashamed of my university right now. There is NEVER a justifiable reason to lob fatalistic character assessments like that onto any kid, especially one like MY. There is ZERO recovery for stuff like that. John Wooden once said that "a coach is someone who can give correction without causing resentment." Tell the newspaper that the team needs more defensive effort from the seniors. Tell them on-court leadership is lacking. Don't tell them a kid can't be coached.

Put your big boy pants on, Coach. If you can't motivate kids with baggage and lead, don't recruit them. At worst, maybe call up Chris Jans at New Mexico State or the Detroit Pistons' Dwayne Casey to find out how they succeeded with Zach Lofton when you couldn't.

So I had to come back to say this is a great post, I totally agree. Sometimes I think the only thing Dan has developed during his tenure is his ability to demotivate and ostracize his players. He's uncoachable? Gtfo dan.

Humdinger
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Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:09 pm

RedbirdSoxFan wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:36 am


Pippen 18 PTS 5 REB against Buffalo

Pippen is going to be a tough matchup for a lot of teams in Valley play. Averaged 17 PTS 6 REB against to pretty good teams (Kentucky & Buffalo)

Pippen is a definite POY candidate in Valley.

RedbirdSoxFan
Junior
Posts: 509
Joined: Wed Jul 19, 2017 1:31 pm

Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:34 pm

Humdinger wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:09 pm
RedbirdSoxFan wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:36 am


Pippen 18 PTS 5 REB against Buffalo

Pippen is going to be a tough matchup for a lot of teams in Valley play. Averaged 17 PTS 6 REB against two pretty good teams (Kentucky & Buffalo)

Pippen is a definite POY candidate in Valley.

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